facing a 4b in blinds with jj..

Amatay · **Posted:** Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:33 pm

Friend of mine....

Only a sh1tty 3r on frog. itm about 7/30 3bettor has us just covered. We have 3b him ip a few times with hand qq and tt. once he folded and once he called and folded to a cbet

we start the hand with 56 bigs so were deepish imo. what do u do here? seems a tough spot in the blinds with jacks? persoanlly i flat or sometimes just shrug my shoulders and just fold unless oppo is a pycho. Is folding terrible? do we wanna 4b get it in here?

PokerStars Hand #82619067032: Tournament #577769286, €2.70+€0.30 EUR Hold'em No Limit - Level XVIII (500/1000) - 2012/06/29 18:13:22 CET [2012/06/29 12:13:22 ET]
Table '577769286 17' 9-max Seat #4 is the button
Seat 1: pangrati (57481 in chips)
Seat 2: calamarc (48390 in chips)
Seat 3: yanis8131 (21347 in chips)
Seat 4: asse44740 (32369 in chips)
Seat 5: HERO (56100 in chips)
Seat 7: koolizit (35499 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 8: Cletus1er (39821 in chips)
Seat 9: lauri97450 (33335 in chips)
pangrati: posts the ante 125
calamarc: posts the ante 125
yanis8131: posts the ante 125
asse44740: posts the ante 125
HERO: posts the ante 125
koolizit: posts the ante 125
Cletus1er: posts the ante 125
lauri97450: posts the ante 12
HERO: posts small blind 500
koolizit: posts big blind 1000
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Cletus1er: raises 1000 to 2000
lauri97450: folds
pangrati: raises 3687 to 5687
calamarc: folds
yanis8131: folds
asse44740: folds
HERO: JJ ? ? ?

Grindmoreplz · **Posted:** Fri Jun 29, 2012 6:09 pm

Were facing 3 bet right?

Prob fold, utg opens and gets 3 bet unless its a really good player this not light.

4 bet get it in seems really bad, without some huge read. flatting seems meh, OR still to act and we will be OOP in a huge pot

Amatay · **Posted:** Fri Jun 29, 2012 6:44 pm

Grindmoreplz wrote:

Were facing 3 bet right?

Prob fold, utg opens and gets 3 bet unless its a really good player this not light.

4 bet get it in seems really bad, without some huge read. flatting seems meh, OR still to act and we will be OOP in a huge pot

yh, i meant 3b obv. its only coz my friend 4b got it in vrs qq that i had 4b on my mind.

yh i agree, i just fold here too.

Bossanova · **Posted:** Tue Jul 03, 2012 2:13 pm

i fold

kenn121 · **Posted:** Wed Jul 04, 2012 2:50 pm

make it 12k and fold to shove imo

kenn121 · **Posted:** Wed Jul 04, 2012 2:52 pm

with size stack its perfect to 4bet fold here, but thats with ATC as well

BurnleyMik · **Posted:** Wed Jul 04, 2012 8:27 pm

kenn121 wrote:

with size stack its perfect to 4bet fold here, but thats with ATC as well

For insight, what are the reasons for 4-betting in this spot?

Amatay · **Posted:** Wed Jul 04, 2012 11:01 pm

kenn121 wrote:

with size stack its perfect to 4bet fold here, but thats with ATC as well

yh, i thought that myself. stack sizes are abs perfect here and you look sooo strong. Just feels dirty turning jj into a bluff and not be tempted to flick it in if u get shoved on praying for ak lol. but yh, agree atc here with stack sizes etc is a nice spot imo

Gorvacofin · **Posted:** Wed Jul 04, 2012 11:36 pm

Seems a bit lol to suggest we can 4-bet bluff JJ profitably here, but can't profitably 4-bet/call it. A raise to 12 prices us in vs QQ+ AK if either of them shoves.

Amatay · **Posted:** Wed Jul 04, 2012 11:45 pm

Gorvacofin wrote:

Seems a bit lol to suggest we can 4-bet bluff JJ profitably here, but can't profitably 4-bet/call it.

i dont think so. as the opener or 3 bettor i would hate my life abit without kk or aa. unless theres some dynamic going on etc. depends on players and buyin etc. in this situ in an lol 3r sigh folding>>getting cute with a 4b

Gorvacofin · **Posted:** Thu Jul 05, 2012 12:00 am

Damn, didn't edit in time.

I probably just fold personally, but it's going to be hard to 4-bet without committing yourself imo. For 4-bet/folding to be best I think they need to have wide ranges but be felting a range tighter than QQ+/AK. Seems unlikely to me.

kenn121 · **Posted:** Thu Jul 05, 2012 1:05 am

fwiw i dont think it matters we have Jj here fo the 4bet to work

i would 4bet here every time my left nut tingles

(it tingles heaps cause i always play with that one)

Bossanova · **Posted:** Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:41 am

what if the 4 bet is called by villain, what next?

lead on any flop?

lead on a T-high flop?

or just give it up?

Amatay · **Posted:** Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:49 am

Bossanova wrote:

what if the 4 bet is called by villain, what next?

lead on any flop?

lead on a T-high flop?

or just give it up?

Mmmm, good point. I'd probably flop a jack myself

Bossanova · **Posted:** Fri Jul 06, 2012 2:31 pm

Amatay wrote:

Bossanova wrote:

what if the 4 bet is called by villain, what next?

lead on any flop?

lead on a T-high flop?

or just give it up?

Mmmm, good point. I'd probably flop a jack myself

That'd be my plan too, but in all other scenarios

It's a tough spot if called though

I don't know about mid-stakes, where the villain probably fold or push pre, but for sure in low stakes, I've seen villains often flat 4 bets

MOOpoker · **Posted:** Fri Jul 06, 2012 7:03 pm

Bossanova wrote:

Amatay wrote:

Bossanova wrote:

what if the 4 bet is called by villain, what next?

lead on any flop?

lead on a T-high flop?

or just give it up?

Mmmm, good point. I'd probably flop a jack myself

That'd be my plan too, but in all other scenarios

It's a tough spot if called though

I don't know about mid-stakes, where the villain probably fold or push pre, but for sure in low stakes, I've seen villains often flat 4 bets

deffo this ^^ and re evaluate flop i guess get it in on safe board and sigh if A/K hits

but i think most gonna shove or fold in this scenario

Dream of Vegas · **Posted:** Fri Jul 06, 2012 7:23 pm

Amatay wrote:

Bossanova wrote:

what if the 4 bet is called by villain, what next?

lead on any flop?

lead on a T-high flop?

or just give it up?

Mmmm, good point. I'd probably flop a jack myself

standard night in Brighton

Dream of Vegas · **Posted:** Fri Jul 06, 2012 7:24 pm

I'd fold btw

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facing a 4b in blinds with jj..

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